Friday, August 20, 2010

Updated List -1750

I'll be posting Part Two of my "Null Deployment" article in a day or so. Until then, here's my updated list:

Chaos Lord, Terminator Armour, Blissgiver, MoS (150)
4 Termies w/ 3 combi melta, 1 chainfist, IoS (165)

5 Champ Termies w/ 4 combi melta, 1 chainfist, IoS (200)

Bikers x 3 melta x 2, icon (129)

Noise Marines x 10 w/ 5 sonics Rhino, DP, Havoc, icon (295)
Noise Marines x 10 w/ 5 sonics Rhino, DP, Havoc, icon (295)

Chosen x 6 w/ 4 plasma, icon of chaos, rhino (213)

Obliterators x 2 (150)
Obliterators x 2 (150)

Total = 1747


  1. I dislike only 2 objective holders, even with this type of list. I know that I tend to just pound troops into the ground, even at the risk of not winning a game, just to not lose. I know some armies don't have that choice, but I just don't think that NM are survivable enough, even in a rhino, in the size games you are going to be looking at against someone who isn't prone to panic when things start dropping on him.

    I would think about running 3 6-man squads in Rhinos, not only for tactical flexibility (Kill-point missions are really only a third or less of the missions you will play, even if you run the Battle Missions book) but then also because Slaanesh's sacred number is 6.

    Also, as I mention above in the tactics pt 2 post, I like Lash better for any army. Blissgiver is ok, and the extra d6 attacks are nice, but battlefield manipulation is so crucial, especially if you plan on choosing to go second if given the option, as you can then start moving troops off of objectives on turn 5.

  2. I haven't given up on up defilers for good, but at the 1750 level there's just not any room for them. While flopping a hot pie plate of AP3 eating goodness on my foes is enjoyable, I'm not sure how that would synergize with the rest of the list. In my experience with reserve defilers, they show up (usually alone), get one good shot off and then get promptly blasted by my opponent.

    The smaller Noise Marine squads idea is solid, and one I've been flirting with a bit. While it is fun to unleash a hail of sonic and bolter fire at my foes, I've found that the large squads are a magnet for nastly templates or crack assault troops. And lets face it, if the unit gets locked in with a Space Wolf rune priest, genestealers, power-fist wearing squad leaders, etc, having 6 or 10 models really doesn't matter that much. So I think you will probably see 3 squads of six in the next incarnation. That said, the expensive rhinos are surprisingly durable and a very useful soak for enemy fire, and I doubt I could go that loaded and still run 3.

    As for the Lash, I'm bittersweet on it. It has won me games, that is no secret; is has also been negated by Tyranid powers, Null hoods and my uncanny ability to roll elevens on two dice roughly 40% of the time. In my 1850 list I do have a lash and a chaos lord, but I've yet to try that build out yet. My biggest problem is that I get dependent on it, and tend to put myself in a position so that when it fails, it fails big.

  3. That is why I run it on a Daemon Prince with Wings. I know it is less elegant, but the Prince is often the MVP of my army. So much so that I start every list I create with:

    Daemon Prince - Slaanesh, Wings, Lash
    Daemon Prince - Slaanesh, Wings, Lash
    Vindicator - Daemonic Possession
    Defiler - 2 Extra Close Combat Weapons
    2 Obliterators

    Even at 1k points, that is the base of EVERY army I play. If I owned a second Vindicator, that would likely replace the Defiler, just because 13 armor front S10 AP2 gun > 12 armor front S8 AP3 gun, even with the lesser range for the Vindy.

    Now obviously this doesn't work as a base for an ND strategy, but it gives you an idea of the importance I place on controlling the flow of the game. Lash gives me too many tactical options and provides a focus for my opponent to shoot at something that is nice to have but I don't rely on having after the second turn anyway. Big guns are targets that your opponent has to address, leaving your troops to do things like take objectives. Played a BA player that didn't destroy my Vindicator and on turn 3 I lashed an assault squad together with his Death Company and wiped both out with the exception of the Chaplain.

    By presenting targets that your opponent has to address or lose the game, it allows you to further control the battlefield. Of course, I am the guy that would play mono-blue in a friendly game of magic as well.

    As for finding the points for the third NM squad, if you are keeping the ratios the same, but going with three of 6, you gain 45 points (dropping 1 regular NM and one Sonic NM) which puts you 30 points from a kitted rhino (assuming you put an icon in the third squad) and 15 from a DP Rhino without the Hvaoc launcher. There are a million places to save those 15 points in the army without necessarily sacrificing effectiveness.